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Backup software recommendations?

We're a small public school system with 4 major sites and 12 NetWare 6
servers. Our current backup solution is Backup Exec 9, but we've had enough
issues with it that we are considering other options rather than just
blindly upgrading to the latest version.

I'd appreciate any comments and suggestions you may have. Here's the list
of software I'm planning to look at:

- NovaNet
- Backup Exec
- ArcServe
- TapeWare
- Galaxy

Are there any others we should consider? What experiences have you had with
any of these that we should keep in mind as we evaluate?

Thanks,

Roger Kresge
York, PA


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Anonymous_User Absent Member.
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Re: Backup software recommendations?

Roger Kresge wrote:

> - NovaNet
> - TapeWare


FYI, these two are identical products. Yosemite writes Tapeware, which
is then resold as NovaNet by Novastor. If I were to choose between the
two, I would go with TapeWare as at least then you're closer to the
actual developers when you need tech support... That said, I used to be
a big fan of NovaNet (and it *was* great compared to the ArcServe's and
Backup Exec's back then), but their support for and knowledge of NetWare
is nearly non-existent. YES, the software runs on NetWare, but if you
call for support (to either company) and start askking NetWare-specific
questions, you will get a response similar to "uuuuh." Also,
TapeWare/NovaNet starts to fall over when you get millions of files in
the database. It does not scale well.

> Are there any others we should consider? What experiences have you had with
> any of these that we should keep in mind as we evaluate?


If you're not severely budget constrained, try Syncsort Backup Express
(www.syncsort.com). You can get a full working trial. It is no where
near the cheapest solution, but on the other hand it actually works.
Downsides are cost and the fact that the master server only runs on
Linux/Windows. Upsides are that it actually works, handles netware (and
netware clusters) better than anyone... and oh, did I mention that it
actually works?

--
Jim
NSC SYsop
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Anonymous_User Absent Member.
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Re: Backup software recommendations?

Make sure you look at SyncSort Backup Express..... As you can see from many
threads in groups it is liked by many, is very stable and has excellent
cluster support....

A definite must

"Roger Kresge" <rogerk_1999@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:tyYYe.6909$Oi6.3358@prv-forum2.provo.novell.com...
> We're a small public school system with 4 major sites and 12 NetWare 6
> servers. Our current backup solution is Backup Exec 9, but we've had
> enough
> issues with it that we are considering other options rather than just
> blindly upgrading to the latest version.
>
> I'd appreciate any comments and suggestions you may have. Here's the list
> of software I'm planning to look at:
>
> - NovaNet
> - Backup Exec
> - ArcServe
> - TapeWare
> - Galaxy
>
> Are there any others we should consider? What experiences have you had
> with
> any of these that we should keep in mind as we evaluate?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Roger Kresge
> York, PA
>
>



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Anonymous_User Absent Member.
Absent Member.

Re: Backup software recommendations?

Jim and Dave,

Thanks for the suggestions and insights. I will definitely add Syncsort
Backup Express to my list.

Roger

"Jim Michael" <jkmichael@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:Y8ZYe.6952$Oi6.5163@prv-forum2.provo.novell.com...
> Roger Kresge wrote:
>
> > - NovaNet
> > - TapeWare

>
> FYI, these two are identical products. Yosemite writes Tapeware, which
> is then resold as NovaNet by Novastor. If I were to choose between the
> two, I would go with TapeWare as at least then you're closer to the
> actual developers when you need tech support... That said, I used to be
> a big fan of NovaNet (and it *was* great compared to the ArcServe's and
> Backup Exec's back then), but their support for and knowledge of NetWare
> is nearly non-existent. YES, the software runs on NetWare, but if you
> call for support (to either company) and start askking NetWare-specific
> questions, you will get a response similar to "uuuuh." Also,
> TapeWare/NovaNet starts to fall over when you get millions of files in
> the database. It does not scale well.
>
> > Are there any others we should consider? What experiences have you had

with
> > any of these that we should keep in mind as we evaluate?

>
> If you're not severely budget constrained, try Syncsort Backup Express
> (www.syncsort.com). You can get a full working trial. It is no where
> near the cheapest solution, but on the other hand it actually works.
> Downsides are cost and the fact that the master server only runs on
> Linux/Windows. Upsides are that it actually works, handles netware (and
> netware clusters) better than anyone... and oh, did I mention that it
> actually works?
>
> --
> Jim
> NSC SYsop



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Anonymous_User Absent Member.
Absent Member.

Re: Backup software recommendations?

The $750/node in extra licenses you need to spend just because you have a
cluster and there is something on it you want to backup, "cluster support"
that means that the software knows if the cluster fails over and it knows to
restart the job instead of pick up where it left off, the slow speeds we see
to disk or tape, or the crappy GUI, makes me think twice about why we bought
this software...

"Dave Lee" <abuse@aol.com> wrote in message
news:CmTZe.272$jT.256@prv-forum2.provo.novell.com...
> Make sure you look at SyncSort Backup Express..... As you can see from
> many threads in groups it is liked by many, is very stable and has
> excellent cluster support....
>
> A definite must
>
> "Roger Kresge" <rogerk_1999@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:tyYYe.6909$Oi6.3358@prv-forum2.provo.novell.com...
>> We're a small public school system with 4 major sites and 12 NetWare 6
>> servers. Our current backup solution is Backup Exec 9, but we've had
>> enough
>> issues with it that we are considering other options rather than just
>> blindly upgrading to the latest version.
>>
>> I'd appreciate any comments and suggestions you may have. Here's the
>> list
>> of software I'm planning to look at:
>>
>> - NovaNet
>> - Backup Exec
>> - ArcServe
>> - TapeWare
>> - Galaxy
>>
>> Are there any others we should consider? What experiences have you had
>> with
>> any of these that we should keep in mind as we evaluate?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> Roger Kresge
>> York, PA
>>
>>

>
>



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Anonymous_User Absent Member.
Absent Member.

Re: Backup software recommendations?

Doug Deitterick wrote:
> The $750/node in extra licenses you need to spend just because you have a
> cluster and there is something on it you want to backup, "cluster support"
> that means that the software knows if the cluster fails over and it knows to
> restart the job instead of pick up where it left off


Are you saying Syncsort doesn't handle clusters appropriately?

>, the slow speeds we see to disk or tape


What do you degfine as slow? We're seeing 50+MB/sec to our virtual tape
library

>, or the crappy GUI


The GUI does leave a lot to be desired, but its no worse (IMO) that the
Arcserve's and Backup Exec's I've used in the past... and at least it
runs in a browser, without a special, bulky client.

>makes me think twice about why we bought this software...


Which is why any sane company would demo the software in production
before committing to it. We ran it for two months, liked it, and never
looked back.

--
Jim
NSC SYsop
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Anonymous_User Absent Member.
Absent Member.

Re: Backup software recommendations?

"Jim Michael" <jkmichael@myrealbox.com> wrote in message
news:IQg_e.1945$jT.1789@prv-forum2.provo.novell.com...
> Doug Deitterick wrote:
>> The $750/node in extra licenses you need to spend just because you have a
>> cluster and there is something on it you want to backup, "cluster
>> support" that means that the software knows if the cluster fails over and
>> it knows to restart the job instead of pick up where it left off

>
> Are you saying Syncsort doesn't handle clusters appropriately?


we've had the cluster failover in the middle of a backup and the job
restarts or fails completely. I wouldn't call that cluster aware.
>
>>, the slow speeds we see to disk or tape

>
> What do you degfine as slow? We're seeing 50+MB/sec to our virtual tape
> library

We are seeing nowhere near that...5-10MB/s if we're lucky.

>
>>, or the crappy GUI

>
> The GUI does leave a lot to be desired, but its no worse (IMO) that the
> Arcserve's and Backup Exec's I've used in the past... and at least it runs
> in a browser, without a special, bulky client.
>
> >makes me think twice about why we bought this software...

>
> Which is why any sane company would demo the software in production before
> committing to it. We ran it for two months, liked it, and never looked
> back.
>
> --
> Jim
> NSC SYsop



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Anonymous_User Absent Member.
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Re: Backup software recommendations?

Doug Deitterick wrote:

> we've had the cluster failover in the middle of a backup and the job
> restarts or fails completely. I wouldn't call that cluster aware.


And what does Syncsort tech support say about it? It certainly shouldn't
act that way... it's hallmark is in fact NOT acting that way.

> We are seeing nowhere near that...5-10MB/s if we're lucky.


Are you letting each node back up individually? What sort of network
fabric to the backup devices? 100Mb ethernet? If so, then I can
understand your poor performance. GB links are a must (that is just data
physics, nothing to do with Syncsort) and you need to tell the software
to back up multiple nodes at once, so 2-4 server's worth of data can be
streamed to your tape device. Again, that isn't really a syncsort issue
either, just backup procedures 101.

--
Jim
NSC SYsop
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Anonymous_User Absent Member.
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Re: Backup software recommendations?

Jim Michael wrote:
....(and it *was* great compared to the ArcServe's...

yes, but it could it abend the server just by typing ASTART at the
console? you just can't get good undocumented features like that
anywhere else 😉
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Anonymous_User Absent Member.
Absent Member.

Re: Backup software recommendations?

I'll let you know what I think about Backup Express in a bit over a
month -- sold a client on the need to 'move up' from Backup Exec.

--
Barry Schnur
Novell Support Connection Volunteer Sysop
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Anonymous_User Absent Member.
Absent Member.

Re: Backup software recommendations?

Barry Schnur wrote:
> I'll let you know what I think about Backup Express in a bit over a
> month -- sold a client on the need to 'move up' from Backup Exec.


I would have convinced them to run a working trial (free) for a couple
of months (because different organizations have different "gripe points"
regarding software), but hopefully it will be a big improvement for
them. Make no mistake: Backup Express is not "perfect" software. The
interface looks very windows 3.1-ish and is clunky, but the overriding
fact is that it *actually works* <G>


--
Jim
NSC SYsop
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Anonymous_User Absent Member.
Absent Member.

Re: Backup software recommendations?


congratulations. don't let the gui scare you. 🙂


--
Cheers!
Richard Beels
~ Network Consultant
~ Sysop, Novell Support Connection
~ MCNE, CNE*, CNA*, CNS*, N*LS


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Anonymous_User Absent Member.
Absent Member.

Re: Backup software recommendations?

> I would have convinced them to run a working trial (free) for a couple
> of months (because different organizations have different "gripe points"
> regarding software), but hopefully it will be a big improvement for
> them. Make no mistake: Backup Express is not "perfect" software. The
> interface looks very windows 3.1-ish and is clunky, but the overriding
> fact is that it *actually works* <G>


Fair point -- I think what we'll do (perhaps this weekend) as a test is
down the existing 4.2 server (I'm assuming Backup Express runs on 4.2
SP9), then install the working trial on that server and use it to
backup to the SDLT320 on that server.

--
Barry Schnur
Novell Support Connection Volunteer Sysop
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Anonymous_User Absent Member.
Absent Member.

Re: Backup software recommendations?

Barry Schnur wrote:

> Fair point -- I think what we'll do (perhaps this weekend) as a test is
> down the existing 4.2 server (I'm assuming Backup Express runs on 4.2
> SP9), then install the working trial on that server and use it to
> backup to the SDLT320 on that server.


Well, BackupExpress can back up a NW 4.2 *client*, but the master server
itself (the part that runs the GUI and manages the backup database) only
runs on Linux or Windows 😉

--
Jim
NSC SYsop
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Anonymous_User Absent Member.
Absent Member.

Re: Backup software recommendations?


> *actually works*

i should have trademarked that phrase when talking about bex... 🙂


--
Cheers!
Richard Beels
~ Network Consultant
~ Sysop, Novell Support Connection
~ MCNE, CNE*, CNA*, CNS*, N*LS


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